#185 From Distress to Success with Business Rescue Practitioner Basson Piek

In this episode, I sit down with Basson Piek - business rescue practitioner and COO of Rauch Gertenbach Attorneys - to talk about business rescue.

We talk honestly about what it really means when a business is in distress, how to know if you’re heading in that direction, and what options are available before it’s too late. Basson shares his journey into this work, the most common reasons businesses land in trouble, and what the business rescue process actually looks like - from early warning signs to dealing with creditors.

We also dive into what makes a rescue successful, why cash flow is king, and the legal responsibilities directors need to understand. Whether you’re in a tough spot or just want to protect your business from future risk, this conversation is packed with practical insight, clarity, and hope.

Download: How to do a solvency test for your business

Connect with Basson Piek:

• Email: office@rgprok.co.za
• Phone: (+27) 44 601 9900
• Website: www.rgprok.co.za

Apply to work with me here, and let's start designing a business that works FOR YOU.

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Track: Positive Motivation
Author: AShamaluevMusic (ASM)
Publisher: CD Baby (IPI 700570289)

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Transcript

Speaker 2 (00:00.11)
The words business rescue often come with a heavy sense of dread. It can feel like failure, like the end, like you've let people down, your team, your family, yourself. If you've been lying awake at night worrying about bulls, payroll or mounting pressure, you're not alone. Here's what most people don't know. Business rescue isn't about giving up. It's about fighting for a second chance and getting the right support to turn things around.

In today's episode, I'm joined by Bassoon Peck, a registered business rescue practitioner and COO of Rauch-Gartenbach Attorneys. He's helped the business owners navigate some of the toughest chapters in their companies and help them come out stronger on the other side. In this episode, we're going to talk about what business rescue actually is, why it doesn't mean failure and how to spot the warning signs early so that you can get help before it's too late. Let's go.

Welcome to the Effortless CEO podcast, the only show that teaches South African business owners how to improve their operations and design a business that can run without them. If you're interested in leading your team more effectively, creating more operational efficiency, delivering with excellence while getting some of your life back, then you're in the right place. Here's your host, strategic intervention coach and operations specialist, Ilonka Russ.

Thank you for joining me on this episode of the podcast. I'm really excited to talk to you today, but before we get started, want you to just briefly introduce yourself and tell us how you got into doing this work that you're doing currently.

Good Ilonka. It's a privilege to join you and thank you for inviting me. I started my career in corporate in Garteng area and in the early 2000s I completed an MBA with the School for Business Leadership of UNESA and at that stage I was working for a Midwest company in Johannesburg. In 2006,

Speaker 1 (02:09.302)
At work I was exposed to quite a serious violent crime, not directly, but my people. And after having bodyguards for two to three months, we decided now it's time to relocate and we relocated to the garden route. And I've been down here ever since. So I'm going on going on 20 years in the garden route. I started off as a CEO for a for an aloe factory in Albertina in the town of Albertina. I was there for five and a half years.

I then ventured into business consulting along the garden route and Rauch-Gartenbach attorneys happened to acquire my services. I then became Chief Operating Officer for Rauch-Gartenbach attorneys for the attorney group. Never thought I'd work for a group of attorneys, but yes, here I am 12 years down the line. And then with the Companies Act changing and being amended,

A few years after that we decided as a strategic option to start investigating business rescues and in 2016 we started with our first business rescue. So we've been going now for about nine years and we've helped a number of businesses and here we are.

It's always interesting to hear everyone's journey in terms of how they move from one thing to the next. We talked about the distressed company and how you help businesses go from in essence distress to success, which is the title of this podcast. If you can just briefly explain to us what exactly is a distressed company or business, how do you know that you are in distress?

Chapter 6 in the Companies Act is quite clear and they actually give a definition where the Companies Act states that a company is financially distressed when, firstly, it appears reasonably unlikely that the company will be able to pay all its debts as they become due and payable within the ensuing six months. So if there's a suspicion that there's a good chance that you're not going to be able to pay your debts in the next six months, you meet the criteria for the first criteria.

Speaker 1 (04:16.024)
for a financially distressed company. Or, and the second one is, if it appears to be reasonably likely that the company will become insolvent in ensuing six months. So if you do the solvency test on your business and it looks like you're going to be insolvent within the next six months, then your business meets the definition of a distressed business.

I'm just thinking as you were talking about this, I was just sort of thinking about business owners and the entrepreneurial spirit and how we can sometimes be very optimistic about the future. And we are always hopeful, always hoping that things will turn around, get better. And obviously we also work to do that. At what point do you know that being hopeful and working hard or tapping into that entrepreneurial grit where you just

make things happen and not making it work isn't an option. At what point do you say, okay, I need help? I am actually in distress because when you say for the foreseeable future, like for the next six months, you won't be able to pay your debts. I'm thinking that many businesses are probably just considering the amount of businesses that I work with and the cashflow challenges that most businesses experience. aren't we all in distress then?

That is true and I on purpose ended my answer bluntly when you asked me about the definition of a distressed business. And it's true what you're saying that if all businesses all of a sudden had to do the solvency test or had to measure themselves against the especially that first element that you're not going to be able to pay your debts within the ensuing six months, then I think probably 80 % of our businesses will have to file for business rescue.

So it's a pretty strict criteria that they've laid down. I think it's really up to each business and it's important for business owners and business management directors especially to understand that they have to be prudent about how they manage their businesses. They have to call in advice. What I find in the market is that business owners react too late. They respond too late to the problem and

Speaker 1 (06:28.332)
It's for various reasons. mean, we're all positive things are going to turn next month is going to be a better month and then next month comes and it doesn't happen. Or we're waiting for this big contract to come in. Even more realistic, we're waiting for this big debtor to pay his debts without always being sure.

that were actually going to be paid. I had a client a few years ago who was waiting for a big payment and I mean it really would have made a difference to this guy's business where they were waiting for a payment from Group 5 and all of a sudden Group 5 went into business rescue. He never got his money, he got a small percentage out of that and that put his business so far back because of the reliance they had on that.

big data to come in. It's a question of reacting quickly, knowing your business, knowing your numbers, staying close to the numbers, attention to detail. And if you see something is wrong, get advice, talk to someone before it's too late. I often compare our jobs as business rescue practitioners. I often compare it to

ER24 arriving at the scene of an accident on the highway. And there are a few wrecks and there are bodies all over the place. And we must quickly decide which bodies we can save. And the ones you get to the earliest and the ones you can identify as early as possible, those are the ones that are most likely to survive. And then when you get to the critical ones, those ones you must decide.

Are they going to go to the mall? Or can we put them in intensive care and then move them from intensive care to high care? And I mean the sooner we identify a problem, the easier it is to counter the problem.

Speaker 2 (08:22.35)
As soon as you notice, okay, things aren't going as planned or things aren't working out the way that we thought it would. We need to ask for help, right? And I think that's something that as business owners or as entrepreneurs, that's something that is sometimes hard for us to do because we're typically the ones that solve problems for the team and for the business. you know, we're the ones that people come to for help. And so sometimes reaching out for help is actually not that easy. doesn't feel, it doesn't.

always come natural to us and I think that's the narrative that we need to change. When we talk about a business that is in this position where they've realized, okay, I need help. What do you typically see are the things that get people to this place where they actually are in distress? Like what are the things that cause businesses to get to this place of distress? One of the things that you obviously mentioned is not knowing the numbers or not being close to the numbers. That's something that I'm always preaching because

because we so often follow our guts on things and sometimes we're wrong. And knowing the numbers and being close to the numbers is the thing that can save you in the end, right? Because the data gives us the information that we need in order to make informed decisions. So what are the common things that cause businesses to head to distress or to get into this situation?

I to the EU 100 % right in terms of the financials and also to respond to them, to know them and to respond correctly. Take action, don't push it out. What I often find and that's the old saying, is king, guys run into cash flow problems. For various reasons, I've seen guys who work on projects use one project's funds to fund another new project.

And that is the critical area. Do not mix projects. Keep the projects segregated from each other. And it's not always easy, but that is the right way of doing it. Then I find that money being used as working capital. And once you're behind with that, it seems as if you never catch up again. And in the end, it will catch up with you.

Speaker 1 (10:41.946)
and it will put you in trouble. Pay UIF, don't fall behind with that, don't fall behind with pay as you earn. Part of the sales deal, see many guys falling behind there. And then really just guys running into cash flow problems and not reacting swiftly enough. Often not talking, not communicating well enough with creditors. Communication is critical. Most of the creditors...

will be understanding if they're just being talked to. Don't hide. The worst thing that you can do is go in hiding because they will snuff you out and then they will come for you aggressively. And often the benefit of having an outside person, like for instance, a business rescue practitioner, whether it's a formal business rescue or whether it's just an informal consulting role that this person plays, it provides, it gives a little bit of

a bit of distance between the company and the creditor because now all of sudden it's a new person they're talking to, it's an objective person, it's a person with a qualification and a license behind it and hopefully someone that will aid in solving the problem that has arisen between the parties.

Yeah, and I also think that just when it comes to someone that is well-versed in the law and how creditors work, what they are allowed to do, what they aren't allowed to do, you as the business owner don't necessarily always know the loopholes or the ways around things or just in essence, what is right and what's wrong. When you have someone that actually knows that side of things well and they can advocate

for you, they can speak on your behalf. I think sometimes that's very helpful because we sometimes out of fear, we agree to things and then we learn after the fact that, that's not actually, they're not actually allowed to do that as creditors or there is actually an alternative way of dealing with this. so having someone that is well-versed in it, I think is definitely the way to go.

Speaker 1 (12:56.662)
well worth spending the money to do that because it could become much more expensive than spending the money to get the right advice.

Yeah, and also just the headache, right? The headache of answering the phone, dealing with creditors who are angry and having someone that is objective.

mean, along that line, know, the Companies Act really wants that to happen because in Section 7K of the Act, it says, Act is there to provide for the efficient rescue and recovery of financially distressed companies. And this includes balancing the rights and interests of all stakeholders involved. So it takes a holistic view of business.

Okay, if someone is in distress and they want to get started on this process, I'm pretty sure that apart from the psychological challenge that comes with making a decision like this, what is the process? What actually happens in business rescue?

Yeah, in barrier billing, when I get to a business rescue in first consultation, second consultation, the business owner is already, he himself or she herself, already in distress personally. So the stress levels are high. The business isn't performing. Creators, everything's on fire. The pressure is on. What I would normally do is first get a

Speaker 1 (14:31.99)
an overview, basic assessment of the business. Just to ascertain and make 100 % sure that we are in distress and what the level of distress is. I think it's important for business owners to understand for directors to understand the implications of business rescue and what the other options are. So if we now decide that we're going to enter business rescue, there are two ways of doing that.

but it's a voluntary action taken by the directors of a company. They will take a resolution, which I will draft for them. There will be a sworn statement that will go with it. And that resolution and sworn statement is then submitted to the CIPC. And the moment that that resolution is taken, the business is in business rescue. The immediate benefit of that is the creditors

and all affected parties talk to the business rescue practitioner who the company has the right to appoint. The company has now appointed the business rescue practitioner together with a resolution and so now everybody deals with the business rescue practitioner. Pressure is off the directors and they can focus on doing their jobs. The second point is it puts an immediate stay or moratorium

on any civil action that any creditor may bring or is busy bringing against the company. If there's talk in the air of liquidation applications, et cetera, it will stop those applications immediately. So there's a freeze on that. This excludes criminal action. Of course, that's not part of the, and doesn't fall under the scope of the company's act.

So that then gives the company breathing space. What will happen then? Once we've got feedback from the CIPC within a day or two that everything's in order and we can go ahead, the business ratio practitioner is then tied to very tight timelines to get the process going. So within five working days of the resolution being taken,

Speaker 1 (16:46.754)
The business rescue practitioner must file with CIPC. That's then the effective date. Within 10 working days of the effective date, a first meeting with all affected parties must be held by the business rescue practitioner. The purpose of that meeting is just to explain to the creditors what the process would be, to explain whether the practitioner act as...

early stage think that there's a reasonable prospect of saving the business. Then after that meeting the business rescue practitioner will then start working on the business on the proposed business rescue plan. The business rescue plan is in a prescribed flow and format by the act and it takes into consideration a number of issues and I'm not going to go into the detail of the business rescue plan. The draft

first draft of that plan must be circulated to all affected parties within 25 days of the effective date of filing for business rescue. So it's a pretty tight timeline.

So when you say affected parties, who would the affected parties be?

That would be creditors, would be staff, shareholders and of course fellow directors.

Speaker 2 (18:00.302)
Because I was just thinking if you have suppliers as an example that you owe money to, have you seen that suppliers, that that damages the relationship with the business?

Yes, sometimes it does, sometimes it doesn't. I think it depends on the pre-existing relationship and it varies from creditor to creditor. Some are more tolerant than others. The banks are quite tough towards business rescue and I have found that one of the first questions I ask anyone coming to see me is, are you making use of your overdraft to finance your business activities?

So it's an in and out, in and out. Because what sometimes happens is that the moment that we file for business rescue and if we haven't got the bank's blessing and we haven't got the bank's support, the bank will just immediately freeze that facility, that overdraft facility. And then we have a problem because your debtors, so let's say you've got a hundred thousand round overdraft facility.

and it has maxed out, but you've got 200,000 or 100, let's call it 120,000 of debtors coming in and they pay it into that account. The bank is going to swallow 100 and will leave you with 20 to run your business. Yeah. And that will obviously be a problem. Yes. So very careful. One's got to consider a number of aspects before you just blindly file for business rescue.

Good to know.

Speaker 1 (19:37.15)
but it can be a very effective tool to use to help you through a distressed period. With every business the circumstances are different. can for instance give you an example of a business where they had exactly that. Their business was dependent on a large debtor that had to pay it. It was in the vicinity of a million two hundred thousand that this debtor had to pay them at the end of the month.

but they owed SARS money. SARS had appointed this data as an agent. So the data was not allowed to pay my client. The data had to pay SARS and SARS, if there was anything remaining, then SARS will pay that back to my client. So we filed for business rescue, which put a moratorium on SARS' instruction to the data, which then allowed the data to pay the funds to our client.

in rescue and we then incorporated in the plan and in the end, Sarge got all their money. My client wasn't put in a wheelchair because of the fact that the cash flow was all of a sudden cut off.

So once the plan is put in place, what's next?

the draft plan is then circulated to all affected persons, but only creditors and unrelated parties are allowed to vote at the meeting for the plan. So there's a second meeting within 10 days after you circulated the draft plan. At that meeting, the business rescue practitioner will then go through the plan, work through the plan, answer any questions.

Speaker 1 (21:15.406)
What we've learned through experience is while we're drafting the plan, we already talk to the main creditors. We already get their buy-in upfront. You still, never know. It depends on what the mix of creditors are. But we try to balance the rights of all the affected parties. And then we have the meeting and the creditors vote. you've got to the, I'm simplifying it, you've got to have 75 % of.

of creators voting for the plan. More often than not, we, as a matter of fact, I've only, we've only had one instance where the creators didn't vote for the plan, but it was one of the main creators that was being difficult. So what we as business-medical practitioners did was we believed that it was an unreasonable vote against the plan. So we brought a court order and I think it was two days before we had to go to court.

to debate the issue, the creator conceded and said, no, it's fine, they'll vote for the plan. Once the plan has been voted for, officially we start implementing the business rescue plan.

Okay. And are you part of that process as well?

Yes, yes. I remain as business rescue practitioner, you remain part of that process up until the date that the plan has been fully implemented. In which case then you will file an implementation notice with the CIPC. And just something important to remember for just for our listeners that the business rescue practitioner once appointed becomes a director in your business. And

Speaker 1 (23:01.33)
is indicated by CIPC that business rescue practitioner is a director in your business until such time that the process has been completed and then CIPC after they've received the implementation notice will then remove the business rescue practitioner again as director of your business.

So that's the process. How long does this typically take on average? Obviously it's going to be different for different scenarios, but how long do you typically work with businesses to actually implement this plan?

That's the process.

Speaker 1 (23:38.382)
I've had rescues that ran for four years and those are ones typically where there's litigation involved. That specific one we were collecting the outstanding debts and there's a big blue chip which I won't mention that was just dragging it out and just delaying the process probably by about two and a half years.

And eventually, eventually we got them to court and we got a judgment in our favor and the money was paid over. And then on the other end, last year, end of last year, I had one, the guy, he came to me early enough when he saw the signs of distress in manufacturing business, he saw the signs of distress, he came to me, we did some restructuring and it was just before

the November, December season. So we were fortunate in that. I think we filed for rescue on the 10th of September. The second week in January, we filed for implementation and the plan had been implemented and executed and everybody was happy. Part of the plan was that the balance pre-rescue debt that he had would be paid off over a six month period.

We're now in June and it's all been settled and the guy's back on track. I'm still involved with his business on a consulting basis. So I still do some hand-holding and I still help and guide and assist where necessary.

I can just imagine the relief of getting to the other side of this and I think that sort leads me to the next question which is

Speaker 2 (25:31.712)
What is the success rate for businesses? you can, obviously it depends on how soon you actually reach out for help, but let's assume businesses are in dire straits and it's not looking good. How many of those businesses actually do turn around and get back on track?

That's a difficult question. I can give you the man on the street answer and then I will go back to what the definition is of a successful rescue and what the act says. From my experience, I'd probably say three out of ten, the man on the street answer. Go back to operating in solvent conditions. So we get them back to solvency.

Yeah. And those are generally either the guys who got to us soon enough or guys who instances where we had some form of investment coming into the business. So either by the business owner himself, selling an asset and reinvesting into the business, providing much needed cash flow and allowing the business to carry on or

an external source, selling the shares in the business, selling some shares in the business to generate cash and cash remains king. If we have cash, we can operate the business. So those are really the key factors in a successful rescue. Section 128.1B of the Act talks about proceedings and when will proceedings, what's the goal of proceedings?

The aim is to maximize the company's chances of continuing in existence on a solvent basis or if that continuation on a solvent basis is not possible to provide a better return for creditors than immediate liquidation. What that means is and as part of every single business rescue plan and required by the Act, we as business rescue practitioners have to in the plan run some simulations.

Speaker 1 (27:48.19)
on the numbers, the financials of the business. And we've got to say to the creditors in the plan, okay, this is our plan and this is how we're to save it. And this will be your dividend based on our plan. Option one, we're going to try and trade ourselves out of it. This is the time period. This is how we're going to deal with it. Option two, if we can't do that, or if we fail in doing it, we will revert within a certain period.

we'll revert to option B, which would be a winding down of the business. So we will sell all the assets and that will then provide X dividend 35 cents in the rent or 45 cents in the rent to creditors. And then we also compare that to what the dividend would be for the immediate liquidation of the business.

and invariably winding it down within business rescue or selling the assets within business rescue is a much more cost-effective option than going the liquidation route and it's a far quicker option. So for creditors and any of our listeners who are maybe a creditor of a company in business rescue, it's easier to let them sell their assets.

in the business rescue than to let it go to a liquidation which will take 18 months whereas generally selling the assets could be a three to four, three to five month process.

Yeah, I think that's obviously everything is taken into consideration and the different scenarios are looked at and then a decision can be made as to which one of those is actually the better way to go. What are some things that people should consider if they are going to go into business rescue or they're in front of this decision now? What would you say is important for them to take into consideration?

Speaker 1 (29:50.848)
One of the big things that probably the guys should take into consideration is liability, directors liability. Section 129.7 of the Act says, if the board of a company has reasonable grounds to believe that the company is financially distressed, but the board has not adopted a resolution to commence business rescue, the board must deliver a written notice to each affected person.

setting out the criteria as referred to in Section 128F, that's the definition of distress, that are applicable to the company and its reasons for not adopting a resolution contemplated in this section. So the Act says that there's a responsibility on the board to look at this and to make a decision or on directors and if you don't,

then it could and I've never seen that happen but I have seen where directors liability could have come in play but you just need one creditor that's upset with you with enough money behind him and he can have you declared a delinquent director. From that perspective guys who own their own businesses, directors of companies they've got to be very careful when considering these things. To me the main consideration is

What is our ability if we file for rescue? What is our ability to trade? And how will it affect our ability to trade? And I've had instances where the guy said to me, it's going to kill us, our suppliers. We're not going to get tenders. It will hamper our ability to trade. I think the market and business in general have gotten more used to business rescue. And I think commerce in South Africa have

realised that business rescue is part of business and I think it's less of a threatening thing to people these days than what it was five or six or let's say pre-COVID. Pre-COVID everybody would just absolutely throw their toys out the cot and become emotional and aggressive whereas business rescue these days have evolved.

Speaker 1 (32:07.304)
to much more of a professional process where people can talk to each other and and the way solutions can be found.

So if we don't want to go down the route of business rescue, there an alternative? Is there anything else that you could do if you decide not to do business rescue?

the first thing is do nothing and try to try to carry on trading but then I mentioned earlier that with the obvious risks that you put yourself under as a director of the business and the guys with CCs they've got to remember you are the member of the CC that's exactly the same as a director and your your responsibilities as a member of the CC

is exactly the same as the responsibilities of a director as set out in the Companies Act. As a second alternative, and we've had a few of those, is where we do something we call a pre-pack, which is not a formal business rescue. We don't file with CIPC, but the business rescue and restructuring practitioner is appointed by the company.

in a restructuring role and we then go through certain processes of the business rescue process as if we're in rescue and we engage with the creditors. I've had two of those which had reasonably good results from the perspective of just settling everybody down and getting things going in the right direction again. You still need a bit of good fortune with that.

Speaker 1 (33:49.646)
Because of the fact that it's not formal, all creditors are not bound by the decisions that you make. Whereas, if I can refer back to the business rescue plan, once that plan has been voted for, it's binding and setting stone, it's binding on all affected parties. It's binding on creditors. If that plan says,

Creators are only going to get 50 cents in the rent. That's what they'll get whether you like the plan or not. Something that I haven't mentioned up to now and something that business owners and directors must be very careful of and be on the lookout. And when I do my first assessment, it's one of the first questions I ask. Sureties. Have you signed personal surety? And be careful of those.

If I put the business in business rescue and my client and or the director of that business has signed a personal surety for one of the creators, he can call that personal surety immediately. doesn't put a business rescue, doesn't put a stay or a moratorium on personal sureties. That is really something between the creator and the director in his personal capacity or the business owner in his personal capacity.

So they can still come for you and generally the banks, the banks are famous for that. They have sureties for everything. They take a few deep breaths and while they're busy with you in the business rescue trying to recoup, they immediately instruct their attorneys to call in the surety and they start going after the business in an individual capacity.

So sureties are dangerous. Try not to sign sureties. I know sometimes you don't have a choice. If you want someone to extend credit to you, they want you to sign a surety. But if ever, if your account is paid up to date and you can somehow get out of a surety signed previously, try to minimize the number of sureties that you've signed. Yeah. Don't just sign the stuff that they put under your nose. Read what you're signing.

Speaker 2 (35:58.722)
That's good.

Speaker 2 (36:03.734)
Yes, yes, I've learned this from my own experience.

Yes, it can be with you.

So I know this wasn't something that we prepared, but I think one of the things that as we were talking, I'm thinking of, you know, in essence, two types of business owners that might be listening to us today. And the first one is the owner or the business owner that knows I'm in trouble. I might need some help. need to investigate this further and definitely reach out to Bassoon. We are going to link up all of his information.

in the show notes as well. But I'm also thinking about the business owner that might be listening to this asking, how do I ensure that I don't actually get to this place? What are a few things that I can do now, not being in trouble, but also protecting my business for the future and ensuring that I don't get there? And obviously, we can't tell the future, things can happen, things don't always go according to plan. But what are the things that we can do as

business owners, two or three things that you would say above all else, you want to make sure that you are doing this or you have this implemented in your business. And this is going to help you to not get to this place of distress.

Speaker 1 (37:23.106)
Listen to Ilonka. Yeah, I mean, just stay in touch with your business. Don't overextend yourself, especially current economic conditions. Be conservative, unless you're one of those businesses that are in a great position where you know there's a demand for your product or your service and things are going well. But apart from that, I think conservative trading is...

Conservative management of your business is important at the moment and watch your cash flow. Watch your cash flow carefully. Collect money's owed and in order to collect money's owed, mean your paperwork has to be in order. A lot of people neglect the paperwork because we don't like paperwork. I don't like paperwork. We don't like the admin but be diligent with that.

and it will stand you in good stead over time. It is a pain, but it's a good habit to have. Check what people give you. Don't just, because you don't have time, lap up the information. Double check the information. Check your financials. Check your numbers. I mean, most business owners enough. And I mean, an entrepreneur is an amazing thing. I've had a few of them in business rescue.

where the guy pulls out a little, the owner pulls out a little notebook where he's made his notes and his sums in terms of his cash flow and a little handwriting while he's, and then this was in the construction business, while he's on the building site, he's standing and he's doing his cash flows and sometimes it was right and sometimes it was wrong. Understand what your exposure is, know what your exposure is. I had a big rescue about two years ago.

We initially, when I consulted with the owner, his perception of what his exposure was, was about a third of what his true exposure was. And it was not small numbers. It was big numbers. And I mean, it's one of those accidents where we get to and we say, there's nothing we can do. It's actually impossible to trade yourself out of this situation. So we sold the assets of the business. We sold some shares in the business.

Speaker 1 (39:39.502)
and the business is still carrying on but in a different form and operated by someone else.

My heart goes out to business owners who are in this position. I've been in this position myself as a business owner. And I think that the message that I want anyone who's listening and who is in this position, I think it's important just to know that you don't have to go through this alone. And I think being in the game of business, being in this arena where we are building businesses, we're employing people, we're working to make an impact in our way, it's just important to know

that you are not alone. There are people who are experienced in these kinds of things. There are people who genuinely like Bassoon wants to help you and who, you know, will hold your hand through every step of this process. reach out, don't suffer in silence or suffer alone. There is help available and you you might just get to the other end of this transformed in so many ways. It's not all doom and gloom. I think there is definitely hope for any business that is finding themselves in this position.

Thank

Absolutely, Ilonka. just to add from my side, I will gladly do a first consultation free. Contact me, really, if you set up a Teams discussion or if I work anywhere in South Africa, if you're in the Garden Route area, we can meet face to face. I'm more than willing to assist and as a start, let's just get talking.

Speaker 2 (41:13.634)
Yeah, it's just open the conversation.

Correct, absolutely.

Thank you, Bassoon. It was really amazing to have you on the show today. Thank you for your advice and expertise. I always say that my belief is that businesses are the change that we want to see in this country. There is so much opportunity for us as business owners. We are here to support each other. So I'm pretty sure everyone listening to this episode found so much value from it. So thank you so much for your time. I'm going to link

Absolutely.

Speaker 2 (41:47.692)
of Bassoon's details into the show notes so if you want to reach out to him you know where to find it.

Thanks for having me, Lonka.